Why are swords "better" than guns?

[soulten]

Well I'll start out small and see your answers to continue my argument. :P

btw I just wanna debate. I personally think the gun is better and should be, considering it was made to replace the sword as a fighting utensil.

I'll start with the element or surprise/Close quarters fighting.

In small quarters a soldier with an assault rifle would be most likely be out matched by someone competent with a sword/s. From the lack of space and chances of friendly fire. Like a battalion of soldiers was ambushed in a small space like a building or from behind.

[analogZero]

Originally Posted by Russkie

Dont forget to burn it, mix the ashes with salt, and seal it in a silver coffin. (And maybe even dump it in the ocean for additional drama)

ahhhh! it's too late! the beast still lives. maybe somebody's gotta sever it's spinal column?

[SteyrAUG]

Originally Posted by soulten

Well I'll start out small and see your answers to continue my argument. :P

btw I just wanna debate. I personally think the gun is better and should be, considering it was made to replace the sword as a fighting utensil.

I'll start with the element or surprise/Close quarters fighting.

In small quarters a soldier with an assault rifle would be most likely be out matched by someone competent with a sword/s. From the lack of space and chances of friendly fire. Like a battalion of soldiers was ambushed in a small space like a building or from behind.

Well God invented bayonets for a reason. Anyway professional soldiers are trained in close quarters combat so a competent soldier should hopefully be able to remember their training and improvise to accommodate the conditions. Of course there is a chance the gunman could be fresh out of training never having any real combat experience which can be a problem, but I guess the same could be said for the swordsman.

Originally Posted by analogZero

ahhhh! it's too late! the beast still lives. maybe somebody's gotta sever it's spinal column?

Please keep the off topic banter to a minimum here. If you dislike my thread so much please just leave it alone.

[yoh]

as an argument to point 4 ... its true that you may not have time to think about anything in that situation ... but ... there are also a few flaws in that 1. must people would not think in that situation but act as fast as possible instinctively and hope for the best 2. master swordsmen anylize things slightly faster than an average joe so they have a slightly better chance of stopping that bullet 3. if in the fight or flight mode the mind can slowdown your perspective of time(making you think time has slowed enough for you to think quicker than norm) meaning you can think about where the bullet may hit and again hope for the best

[puppetz]

people are still arguing over this? gun = superior. nuff said

[analogZero]

so sorry, but I'm not a fan of repetition, and that's all this thread's really resorted to. people who post thoughts that were said pages upon pages back, and then a lengthy repetitive retort essentially copied and pasted from the original response.


Kaboom, guns beat swords. any new business?

[SteyrAUG]

Originally Posted by yoh

as an argument to point 4 ... its true that you may not have time to think about anything in that situation ... but ... there are also a few flaws in that 1. must people would not think in that situation but act as fast as possible instinctively and hope for the best 2. master swordsmen anylize things slightly faster than an average joe so they have a slightly better chance of stopping that bullet 3. if in the fight or flight mode the mind can slowdown your perspective of time(making you think time has slowed enough for you to think quicker than norm) meaning you can think about where the bullet may hit and again hope for the best

1. True, but the average Joe will do that whether he has a gun or a sword. At least with a gun you have better range. Average Joe with a rifle stands a decent chance against someone of similar skill carrying a sword. An untrained swordsman is going to probably swing randomly rather than a precision attack that has been practised many times.

2. You're comparison is putting a trained professional up against someone inexperienced. Why not just have an 8th grader go up against Mike Tyson in a boxing match? A trained marine has a better chance of dodging a blade. Still the "faster perception" or whatever you want to call it is not fast enough. The blink of an eye is the time it takes a bullet to leave a gun, travel 50 yards, and hit the target. That's all, just the blink of an eye. Nobody has the ability to look at a gun, calculate the trajectory they bullet is going to go at, then move their sword into place all in the blink of an eye. It's just not humanly possible.

3. Ok let's examine the Nato 5.56mm bullet. This bullet is about 1/4 inch wide and like an inch or two long. In an M4 rifle the muzzle velocity is about 900 meters a second so really at 50 yards you probably have less than the blink of an eye to react. Still the adrenaline "slows time". The problem is it doesn't slow time enough. If time were slowed by like 10 times then maybe you would have a chance, even then I doubt it. Time perception is pretty hard to measure, but even if time slowed to 1/5 speed for you the perception of the speed of the bullet would be like the speed of a baseball in the major leagues with a target that is like 1/12 the diameter of a baseball and swinging something that is much much smaller than a baseball bat. The margin of error there would be pretty much 0. Even a master swordsman under the rush of adrenaline wouldn't have the ability to think and move in time.

[yoh]

i dont know if your gettin my second point or not but you see in a samuri duel between two sword masters the duel ends in mere seconds so if you replace 1 sword master with an avrage joe whom uses a sword like what he sees in anime or movies he doesnt stand a chance and wont even get through 1/4 of his swing before the sword master slices off his arm ... and some people would brobably not think about the trajectery of the bullet they would most likly just look and try to defend ... and ofcoars a trained marine has a better chance of dodging a blade but you also have to take into account that some people(including marines and swordsmen) forget some stuff(things that may seem insignificant and rarly something important) in the heat of battle so there is a possibility, though extremly slim, that the marine would forget something while under attack that may leave an opening for a swordsman to defeat the marine(remember the chance is extremly slim my estamit of the odds of that happening though would have to be about 10,000,000,000,000,000,000/1)

[Vakarak]

Originally Posted by yoh

as an argument to point 4 ... its true that you may not have time to think about anything in that situation ... but ... there are also a few flaws in that 1. must people would not think in that situation but act as fast as possible instinctively and hope for the best 2. master swordsmen anylize things slightly faster than an average joe so they have a slightly better chance of stopping that bullet 3. if in the fight or flight mode the mind can slowdown your perspective of time(making you think time has slowed enough for you to think quicker than norm) meaning you can think about where the bullet may hit and again hope for the best

Originally Posted by SteyrAUG

3. Ok let's examine the Nato 5.56mm bullet. This bullet is about 1/4 inch wide and like an inch or two long. In an M4 rifle the muzzle velocity is about 900 meters a second so really at 50 yards you probably have less than the blink of an eye to react. Still the adrenaline "slows time". The problem is it doesn't slow time enough. If time were slowed by like 10 times then maybe you would have a chance, even then I doubt it. Time perception is pretty hard to measure, but even if time slowed to 1/5 speed for you the perception of the speed of the bullet would be like the speed of a baseball in the major leagues with a target that is like 1/12 the diameter of a baseball and swinging something that is much much smaller than a baseball bat. The margin of error there would be pretty much 0. Even a master swordsman under the rush of adrenaline wouldn't have the ability to think and move in time.

okay let's put this "time change" to a rest. The human eye sees an average of 30 frames per second. That is: our eyes act as cameras and take pictures of the world and they take and process with the help of our brain 30 pictures in one second. When adrenaline kicks in we may see at about 40-60 frames (i'm not sure about these figures) per second which has the slowing down of time attributed to in news interviews with heroes and so on. Time is still moving at a normal pace it's just you're seeing faster than normal and i think most animals like eagles and so on see at those speeds and that helps to their insanely fast reaction speeds but unfortunately even seeing at those speeds these animals CAN NOT DODGE A BULLET.

[SteyrAUG]

Originally Posted by yoh

i dont know if your gettin my second point or not but you see in a samuri duel between two sword masters the duel ends in mere seconds so if you replace 1 sword master with an avrage joe whom uses a sword like what he sees in anime or movies he doesnt stand a chance and wont even get through 1/4 of his swing before the sword master slices off his arm ... and some people would brobably not think about the trajectery of the bullet they would most likly just look and try to defend ... and ofcoars a trained marine has a better chance of dodging a blade but you also have to take into account that some people(including marines and swordsmen) forget some stuff(things that may seem insignificant and rarly something important) in the heat of battle so there is a possibility, though extremly slim, that the marine would forget something while under attack that may leave an opening for a swordsman to defeat the marine(remember the chance is extremly slim my estamit of the odds of that happening though would have to be about 10,000,000,000,000,000,000/1)

Marines are pretty well trained. Most chances are they would shoot the samurai down before he gets close enough to hit the marine with a sword.

Originally Posted by Vakarak

okay let's put this "time change" to a rest. The human eye sees an average of 30 frames per second. That is: our eyes act as cameras and take pictures of the world and they take and process with the help of our brain 30 pictures in one second. When adrenaline kicks in we may see at about 40-60 frames (i'm not sure about these figures) per second which has the slowing down of time attributed to in news interviews with heroes and so on. Time is still moving at a normal pace it's just you're seeing faster than normal and i think most animals like eagles and so on see at those speeds and that helps to their insanely fast reaction speeds but unfortunately even seeing at those speeds these animals CAN NOT DODGE A BULLET.

That's precisely what I mean. The slowing of time perception is not enough to make the needed difference.