cant sleep, it occupies my dreams

[Shadow-San]

in march 2oo3, i was deployed to Iraq. while there i killed, destroyed lives, and in some cases i am quite sure i committed murder, i am responsible for the death of 2 children, 5 women, and several,several men. i'm not including the ones that i dont know if i killed, only the ones i absolutely know my bullets struck down. since then it has affected my life, my jobs and how i interact with people in general. i know its pretty pathetic tho confess something like this in a thread on an anime site, but it was here and, i barely sleep anymore, their faces plague and invade my dreams. on average i sleep 2 or 3 hours a night, ive been to therapy and there isnt shit they can do. so, here i sit at my computer spilling this out, not knowing why, but here it is for all to see, maybe this will help.....

[Ryuuzaki]

That's the cost of being in a war. Your never going to be the same. You'll see those faces until the day you die. There's not much that can be done about it either. Why this happened is probably because you regret it. You wish you hadn't taken those people's lives. Sure, for some reason or another you did it because it was the thing to do. But yep, that's probably why.

[Shigami]

As L said,they appear in you're dream's because you regret killing them.All you need to do to get rid of that feeling,is live without regrets.Imagine,what they would do if they were alive >.> They would have killed you! It's either them or you.

Be glad you killed them,if you didn't you wouldn't be able to talk to us here now would you .. Anyhow it's quite evil way to look at it but it might help.

[analogZero]

As per your condition, it's one which was most commonly seen after the vietnam war but essentially breaks down to this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychological_trauma

You should take into consideration the meaning of repentance. It's not the simple forgiveness of god by confessing your sins, or an easy balancing of the cosmos by doing something really good to make up for something really bad. You've taken the first step in admitting that what you did is wrong, and while you may think it be to us to say you don't deserve to be forgiven, or that you may be excused, that won't cure you of your condition. Even if you managed to convince the people who's lives you've fractured and damaged to grant you some form of forgiveness, it could easily leave you with the same trauma. The 'purification of the soul' you seek is something you have to find in yourself. It's the act of YOU forgiving your own sins and it's going to be much more difficult than convincing us that you're truly sorry. Understand the meaning of all actions you take and you'll know the errors of your ways.

[shadowmaks]

War is meaningless. Many people are killed for no reason. Shadow-San, I don't know what I can do to help you but ,here goes, IT WASN'T YOUR DAM FAULT. You faught for what you belived in. You were used like a tool. Loyal but used. The only thing I can say is live your life to the fullest. Work to help those in need,work for the sake of yourself.Don't let your life fly away from your own grip. To those that have died, there is no way to ever replace those that have been lost but don't mourn over them. I don't know what you've been though, heck I'm only 14!

[Unknown]

Imagine,what they would do if they were alive >.> They would have killed you! It's either them or you.


I disagree with this part of your post. I won't explain it because it goes against Shadow-San. I don't want to make it worst for him [oh joy, I have a caring heart -the more you know]

Anyway, it isn't your fault you had to do what was necessary.

[leerock89]

Well be happy that you have these problems cause if you didn't you are one cold ass mother f'er. Have you thought about taking anti depressants or maybe joining a cult or dogmatic religion?

[gunbound15]

dont' think about the lives you took, think about the ones you saved. the people you killed probably hate you now but they're a********* if they haven't already forgiven you. you did what you did for people like them and they should be grateful even if they are dead. if you have children, think about what you've done for them by making the world a little bit safer. killing is wrong but you do it so others won't have to do it and go through the same thing you did. that makes what you're doing justified if not right. so rest easy at night.

[monsoon 10]

War is meaningless. Many people are killed for no reason. Shadow-San, I don't know what I can do to help you but ,here goes, IT WASN'T YOUR DAM FAULT. You faught for what you belived in. You were used like a tool. Loyal but used. The only thing I can say is live your life to the fullest. Work to help those in need,work for the sake of yourself.Don't let your life fly away from your own grip. To those that have died, there is no way to ever replace those that have been lost but don't mourn over them. I don't know what you've been though, heck I'm only 14!

War isn't meaningless it has it's upsides to you biased retard. Also which one of you brutes deleted my previous post on this thread?

[shadowmaks]

Sorry if I affended you but I'm no biased retard. I just don't know why people are willing to kill each other was something that could be meaningless. I'm was only trying th cheer Shadow-San up anyway. Also, I don't remember any previos posts...maybe you didn't submit it when you thought you did or someone did delete it, I don't know. Again, I never meant to affend anyone Monsoon 10.

[Koopaking]

War isn't meaningless it has it's upsides to you biased retard. Also which one of you brutes deleted my previous post on this thread?

I did because the Therapy forum rules state to never make fun of or insult anyone in here no matter what their problem is.

[monsoon 10]

I did because the Therapy forum rules state to never make fun of or insult anyone in here no matter what their problem is.

I didn't insult him. I told him what he did was murderous which by definition it pretty much was, and I told him his confession disgusted me which by technicality is not an insult to him or his character. Then I told him to go see if he could try to do some missionary work in the area that he was stationed in. The only thing I see that could possibly be taken as an insult towards him was that I told him he was being lazy.

[Koopaking]

You know what, you are absolutely right and have the authority to make these kind of decisions.</sarcasm>

[monsoon 10]

You know what, you are absolutely right and have the authority to make these kind of decisions.</sarcasm>

I'm just stating my case, I believe I'm entitled to that.

[Koopaking]

indeed you are

[alsharid]

dont' think about the lives you took, think about the ones you saved. the people you killed probably hate you now but they're a********* if they haven't already forgiven you. you did what you did for people like them and they should be grateful even if they are dead. if you have children, think about what you've done for them by making the world a little bit safer. killing is wrong but you do it so others won't have to do it and go through the same thing you did. that makes what you're doing justified if not right. so rest easy at night.

he killed children and woman how could that help save lives exactly??

[Ryuuzaki]

he killed children and woman how could that help save lives exactly??

Because they could rebel against them. They could end up shooting them if they aren't careful.

[Shadow-San]

okay. maybe i should have been more clear as to why the women and children died, the first child, it was dark, we were preforming a night raid on a house known to assist , and i use the word only for a lack of proper word for it because a rebel doesnt intentionally kill his own people, terrorists, i led my squad towards the rear of the complex, then someone came around the corner with what in the dark looked like a rifle and turned towards us, i thought it was a man crouched, like i said, it was dark, and i shot, when we got sloser, it turned out to be a child with a big stick, the next was in broad daylight and the kid was shooting at us from the roof top, i shot him as he tried firing on my convoy again, later i found out it was a kid, the reason the women died is because they picked up arms against us, i didnt fight in the war because i wanted to, i actually thought of leaving the military, running if you will, desertion, but when i thought of being a coward, of letting my men die when there was something i could do to prevent it, to keep my men alive, then in good conscience, leave them to dry, no one would take care of my men, my section, like myself and my own nco's would, i was and e-4 promotable, a cpl, and now, the only reason i could even think of for them to still be in my mind, is because no matter what, i think killing, even if it must be done, even to save your own life, is an act which tears the soul out of a person. i posted here because in all actuality, i feel more comfortable with you people whom i dont know, than i do even to my closest friends, whom may, if i ever revealed what it was that ive done, that they may not see me the same way, they dont know that i was ever a soldier, that i was ever in iraq, or that i have ever even hurt someone not in the ring or in the defence of someone else.

no matter whats posted here i wont take offense to it, i wouldnt have posted here if i did. so post what you feel, part of this therapy is to post what you feel right, then feel free.

[leerock89]

Well it seems the majority of it was done in self defense. One of the main reasons a lot of americans experience post war syndrome is the fact that they are very protected through out their lives so when they finally do see death and participate in it it throws a wrench into the cog works. I believe someone said it best, before the post was deleted. Its a dog eat dog world and you did what you thought you had to do to survive. And its a freaken war. What the hell did you think you were going to do when you joined the army???? What train then go have fun until your done with your term?????? Bet you the luster of being in the army is gone now eh? Its ok though. If dense people didn't go join the army then we wouldn't be able to wage wars. At any rate I'm not to sure there is a good cure for this other then hours upon hours of theropy. And like I posted before you can start taking drugs(bad idea) or you can join a cult or religion to repent for the sins your beating yourself with. In other words, it's in your head. Do what you think you have to do to get rid of it. No one else can tell you how to fix it.

[MizuWillow]

There is nothing wrong with saving your men. You did what you had to do.

[monsoon 10]

okay. maybe i should have been more clear as to why the women and children died, the first child, it was dark, we were preforming a night raid on a house known to assist , and i use the word only for a lack of proper word for it because a rebel doesnt intentionally kill his own people, terrorists, i led my squad towards the rear of the complex, then someone came around the corner with what in the dark looked like a rifle and turned towards us, i thought it was a man crouched, like i said, it was dark, and i shot, when we got sloser, it turned out to be a child with a big stick, the next was in broad daylight and the kid was shooting at us from the roof top, i shot him as he tried firing on my convoy again, later i found out it was a kid, the reason the women died is because they picked up arms against us, i didnt fight in the war because i wanted to, i actually thought of leaving the military, running if you will, desertion, but when i thought of being a coward, of letting my men die when there was something i could do to prevent it, to keep my men alive, then in good conscience, leave them to dry, no one would take care of my men, my section, like myself and my own nco's would, i was and e-4 promotable, a cpl, and now, the only reason i could even think of for them to still be in my mind, is because no matter what, i think killing, even if it must be done, even to save your own life, is an act which tears the soul out of a person. i posted here because in all actuality, i feel more comfortable with you people whom i dont know, than i do even to my closest friends, whom may, if i ever revealed what it was that ive done, that they may not see me the same way, they dont know that i was ever a soldier, that i was ever in iraq, or that i have ever even hurt someone not in the ring or in the defence of someone else.

no matter whats posted here i wont take offense to it, i wouldnt have posted here if i did. so post what you feel, part of this therapy is to post what you feel right, then feel free.

You should have gone apocalypse now. *movie reference*

[Ayumu]

I know a guy that was in the military that feels about the same way as you. Although he only admitted it when he was drunk. But I think that at least you dont hide the way you feel about what happened to you. That might be the first step to solving your problem though it might not seem like it. I think that you should think about the long term effect that you have helped bring to the iraqi people. Even if the war is not over, the people are a bit more liberated than before.

[alsharid]

I know a guy that was in the military that feels about the same way as you. Although he only admitted it when he was drunk. But I think that at least you dont hide the way you feel about what happened to you. That might be the first step to solving your problem though it might not seem like it. I think that you should think about the long term effect that you have helped bring to the iraqi people. Even if the war is not over, the people are a bit more liberated than before.

I dont quite agree with you, many iraqis have told me the days of Saddam were more peaceful.

[analogZero]

okay. maybe i should have been more clear as to why the women and children died, the first child, it was dark, we were preforming a night raid on a house known to assist , and i use the word only for a lack of proper word for it because a rebel doesnt intentionally kill his own people, terrorists, i led my squad towards the rear of the complex, then someone came around the corner with what in the dark looked like a rifle and turned towards us, i thought it was a man crouched, like i said, it was dark, and i shot, when we got sloser, it turned out to be a child with a big stick, the next was in broad daylight and the kid was shooting at us from the roof top, i shot him as he tried firing on my convoy again, later i found out it was a kid, the reason the women died is because they picked up arms against us, i didnt fight in the war because i wanted to, i actually thought of leaving the military, running if you will, desertion, but when i thought of being a coward, of letting my men die when there was something i could do to prevent it, to keep my men alive, then in good conscience, leave them to dry, no one would take care of my men, my section, like myself and my own nco's would, i was and e-4 promotable, a cpl, and now, the only reason i could even think of for them to still be in my mind, is because no matter what, i think killing, even if it must be done, even to save your own life, is an act which tears the soul out of a person. i posted here because in all actuality, i feel more comfortable with you people whom i dont know, than i do even to my closest friends, whom may, if i ever revealed what it was that ive done, that they may not see me the same way, they dont know that i was ever a soldier, that i was ever in iraq, or that i have ever even hurt someone not in the ring or in the defence of someone else.

no matter whats posted here i wont take offense to it, i wouldnt have posted here if i did. so post what you feel, part of this therapy is to post what you feel right, then feel free.

we are not chilren, women, men, nations, countries, religions, organizations, soldiers, or tools. at best you've committed manslaughter on another HUMAN BEING. You seem to hold a grand mistrust in that you feel you're the only one who could protect. While it may be some type of superiority complex you felt at the time, or a simple parental like attachment the problem was strong enough to keep you from abandoning your post. You had no trust in your troop in their keeping self sufficient, nor did you trust anyone else to take your place. Let it be and evade this part of your conscience. It's only doing you harm to think like that. You have psychological issues from this whole incident, and getting it treated by somebody real rather than a collective of randoms and teenagers with mixed biased opinions is only going to leave you in the same spot with more to think about. find your own salvation. It's there, YOU just have to find it.

[Ayumu]

I dont quite agree with you, many iraqis have told me the days of Saddam were more peaceful.

That mabey so...but what about the geniside that Saddam carried out against the Shi'ites. Well I dont really know much about him or the war. Just what i looked up on wiki and the news.

[monsoon 10]

That mabey so...but what about the geniside that Saddam carried out against the Shi'ites. Well I dont really know much about him or the war. Just what i looked up on wiki and the news.

If you're uninformed about a topic why even bother posting? Really....

[Shadow-San]

well, this turned out to a little more....well just more, than i thought it would be. Analogzero, i didn't post this to be "treated", i posted to get it of my chest and to see the reaction it elicited from general people, like yourself. though your opinions are biased, frivolous, and very dogmatically forwarded, you are at least expressing an honest opinion and aren't afraid to say what you mean, or at least what you think will have an effect and reaction from others. i am not offended by anything you say, in all honesty, i find it curious as to what your opinions are based upon, a religious doctrine perhaps? if your Judeo-Christian (for those of you who don't know what that means, its the proper name for Christianity, as it stems from Judiasm), the bible says a soldier is one of the most honorable services you can preform, if you're another, id like to know which. Besides, if your griefs are being founded in pure humanitarian concern, when was the last time you stopped to help someone on the street, the last time you helped donate money to a charity, led a food drive, felt and acted upon a concern for any other living thing aside from yourself? you criticize others actions, but now i pose the question and turn the spot light, upon you, when was the last time you actually felt concern for the children in Ethiopia on tv? you know the ones whose stomach protrude and their back bones can stab someone to death when they hug em. ok so have fun in the reply, ive explained myself to you all, now please, explain your opinion to me.

And stop bashing on each other, if you can't be a non-asshole when you quote someone, then don't, don't be dicks to each other, and don't be an asshole and try to thrust your opinions on the others, if they dont agree, then agree to disagree and let it lay out there.

[monsoon 10]

To be honest out of all the people in the world, the ones that get almost all of my sympathy and free time to think are those starving children of Africa.

[Unknown]

And stop bashing on each other, if you can't be a non-asshole when you quote someone, then don't, don't be dicks to each other, and don't be an asshole and try to thrust your opinions on the others, if they dont agree, then agree to disagree and let it lay out there.

It's what I do.
Mainly for the lulz.

[monsoon 10]

It's what I do.
Mainly for the lulz.

Channer me thinks.

[analogZero]

well, this turned out to a little more....well just more, than i thought it would be. Analogzero, i didn't post this to be "treated", i posted to get it of my chest and to see the reaction it elicited from general people, like yourself. though your opinions are biased, frivolous, and very dogmatically forwarded, you are at least expressing an honest opinion and aren't afraid to say what you mean, or at least what you think will have an effect and reaction from others. i am not offended by anything you say, in all honesty, i find it curious as to what your opinions are based upon, a religious doctrine perhaps? if your Judeo-Christian (for those of you who don't know what that means, its the proper name for Christianity, as it stems from Judiasm), the bible says a soldier is one of the most honorable services you can preform, if you're another, id like to know which. Besides, if your griefs are being founded in pure humanitarian concern, when was the last time you stopped to help someone on the street, the last time you helped donate money to a charity, led a food drive, felt and acted upon a concern for any other living thing aside from yourself? you criticize others actions, but now i pose the question and turn the spot light, upon you, when was the last time you actually felt concern for the children in Ethiopia on tv? you know the ones whose stomach protrude and their back bones can stab someone to death when they hug em. ok so have fun in the reply, ive explained myself to you all, now please, explain your opinion to me.

And stop bashing on each other, if you can't be a non-asshole when you quote someone, then don't, don't be dicks to each other, and don't be an asshole and try to thrust your opinions on the others, if they dont agree, then agree to disagree and let it lay out there.

I'm by no means religious, and don't wish to imply such intent. My words here may hold a biased dogma as you would put it, but they're utterly basic in their meaning of how to care and appreciate another human being. It's all to easy to slip past simplicity nowadays and a good pause, or thread post in this case can be a good opportunity for you to step back and analyze the situation. However in posting this I can't help but imagine that you're seeking relief, and I can appreciate why. As for your redirection:

http://www.animefuel.com/forum/showthread.php?p=15754#post15754

My answer's here, and I hope a handful of people have donated a little of themselves to the world around them as a result. The problem being is that with all the hardship there is to be remedied, you'd have to sacrifice yourself a thousand times over to see any form of result in the plights you've mentioned. It may seem selfish to go through life unintentionally disregarding the chaos that exists, but how else are we supposed to live. If I take care of myself to survive, am I selfish? about as selfish as a malnurished child is greedy. Should I give my money to a charity that's only going to redirect my funds to their administration fees? or should I pay taxes to a government that instead of using my money to aid refugees and implement low income housing and salvaging the lives of natural disaster victims, they decide to spend it on extending a war effort? In my experience I can only give to what I know will help right then and there. But as someone who can just barely afford the modesty of the life I've created for myself, there's only so much I can do with paper and coins, and far more I can do for the people around me with just myself.

[Shadow-San]

I'm by no means religious, and don't wish to imply such intent. My words here may hold a biased dogma as you would put it, but they're utterly basic in their meaning of how to care and appreciate another human being. It's all to easy to slip past simplicity nowadays and a good pause, or thread post in this case can be a good opportunity for you to step back and analyze the situation. However in posting this I can't help but imagine that you're seeking relief, and I can appreciate why. As for your redirection:

http://www.animefuel.com/forum/showthread.php?p=15754#post15754

For a person so dedicated to voicing their opinion, and so quick to criticize the position others have on things, you do little to nothing to change the world around you. The world in which you obviously hold such high contempt. You state openly that you do nothing unless you get instant gratification. No, i actually don't disagree with you on many aspects of your arguments. But to be able to sit back comfortably and say what you want when you've apparently and abrasively done nothing, is something that doesn't sit well with me. As for your statement that I'm seeking relief, again, i don't expect relief of this issue, nor do i actually feel guilty, which is the reason that I'm concerned. Its the opposite, im actually proud of their deaths, aside from the one of the children, the one with the stick, the other child, well fire a upon expect to be fired upon . im proud that im alive and theyre dead. im proud that i came back when so many of my friends didnt and havent. im proud of my accomplishments, which is actually what i consider my entire iraq tour, even the down times when i was playing halo. No, i dont feel guilt on the subject, yes, i see their faces in my dreams, i re-enact every scenario that i experienced, and i dont feel a shred of guilt. i wake up with the familiar adrenaline rush that i experienced then. the reason it affects my interactions with people, is that i want to spew it forth as ive done here, to scream at the top of my lungs in victory, like ancient gladiators. killing to me, is an honorable profession. i made money to kill. i dont feel bad about the deaths of any but that one child. one out of them all. many of the men i killed deserved to die by a much more harsh means. some, i would kill again for their crimes, rape, murder, and many others. To me, a murdered murderer is justice. I dont hate myself for theyre deaths, and i think in some aspects that its sad that i dont, and that, maybe, i should. So in posting this, i guess im mainly looking for confirmation.

But you my friend, who have most likely formed your opinions by observation and not actual experience, i pity. not bashing you at all. really. but to not have the experience that i have, i wouldnt be who i am today. i truly do care for the entirety of the world. and no, like i said before, i didnt support nor did i agree with the war in iraq, yes, i think that it has gone on too long, yes, there are a ton of iraqis that believe it was better with sadaam, and yes, im inclined to agree. but no, i dont think anything i did was exactly wrong, no, i dont feel any moral turpitude or remorse for it, and no, i dont believe that youre opinions are based upon any relative experience. i admire those who are fighting over there, on both sides. willing to die for what you believe is putting the fire to your mettle, testing if you believe what you say.

in regards to your comments (at best you've committed manslaughter on another HUMAN BEING. You seem to hold a grand mistrust in that you feel you're the only one who could protect. While it may be some type of superiority complex you felt at the time, or a simple parental like attachment the problem was strong enough to keep you from abandoning your post. You had no trust in your troop in their keeping self sufficient, nor did you trust anyone else to take your place.) mistrust,no, i had confidence in my direct superiors, but you go through basic, airborne, and air assault training with virtually every member of your squad, you feel a certain responsibility towards them.Superiority complex, most likely, your taught that in the military, youre better than civilians, and i agree to an extent. as for abandoning my post i have 7 things to say to that:

L oyalty
D uty
R espect
S elfless service
H onor
I ntegrity
P ersonal courage

These are the 7 army core values, the values ingrained in every soldier, and the first letter of all the values create the acronym "ldrship" or LEADERSHIP. with that being said, i felt all of analyzed all of these aspects before making my decision not to leave. I felt such a strong attachment, such a strong commitment to my friends, that i would give my life to save theirs. Can you say you bear any such loyalties? even to yourself and even to superseding your own safety? i can prove i do, i bear the scar from a gunshot on my chest, i bear the wounds of losing friends that i love, and i bear the scars, of pride. Do you?

Thank you all whove posted here, i was looking for confirmation and ive attained it.

[DocHack]

Will im not good at this stuff, but since you ask shadow.... here goes... you was only trying to protect yourself and your men. What happened to the first kid was a complete accident b/c you would never expect a kid to be raid. This is all I can say, sorry cant be much of help

[analogZero]

For a person so dedicated to voicing their opinion, and so quick to criticize the position others have on things, you do little to nothing to change the world around you. The world in which you obviously hold such high contempt. You state openly that you do nothing unless you get instant gratification. No, i actually don't disagree with you on many aspects of your arguments. But to be able to sit back comfortably and say what you want when you've apparently and abrasively done nothing, is something that doesn't sit well with me. As for your statement that I'm seeking relief, again, i don't expect relief of this issue, nor do i actually feel guilty, which is the reason that I'm concerned. Its the opposite, im actually proud of their deaths, aside from the one of the children, the one with the stick, the other child, well fire a upon expect to be fired upon . im proud that im alive and theyre dead. im proud that i came back when so many of my friends didnt and havent. im proud of my accomplishments, which is actually what i consider my entire iraq tour, even the down times when i was playing halo. No, i dont feel guilt on the subject, yes, i see their faces in my dreams, i re-enact every scenario that i experienced, and i dont feel a shred of guilt. i wake up with the familiar adrenaline rush that i experienced then. the reason it affects my interactions with people, is that i want to spew it forth as ive done here, to scream at the top of my lungs in victory, like ancient gladiators. killing to me, is an honorable profession. i made money to kill. i dont feel bad about the deaths of any but that one child. one out of them all. many of the men i killed deserved to die by a much more harsh means. some, i would kill again for their crimes, rape, murder, and many others. To me, a murdered murderer is justice. I dont hate myself for theyre deaths, and i think in some aspects that its sad that i dont, and that, maybe, i should. So in posting this, i guess im mainly looking for confirmation.

But you my friend, who have most likely formed your opinions by observation and not actual experience, i pity. not bashing you at all. really. but to not have the experience that i have, i wouldnt be who i am today. i truly do care for the entirety of the world. and no, like i said before, i didnt support nor did i agree with the war in iraq, yes, i think that it has gone on too long, yes, there are a ton of iraqis that believe it was better with sadaam, and yes, im inclined to agree. but no, i dont think anything i did was exactly wrong, no, i dont feel any moral turpitude or remorse for it, and no, i dont believe that youre opinions are based upon any relative experience. i admire those who are fighting over there, on both sides. willing to die for what you believe is putting the fire to your mettle, testing if you believe what you say.

in regards to your comments (at best you've committed manslaughter on another HUMAN BEING. You seem to hold a grand mistrust in that you feel you're the only one who could protect. While it may be some type of superiority complex you felt at the time, or a simple parental like attachment the problem was strong enough to keep you from abandoning your post. You had no trust in your troop in their keeping self sufficient, nor did you trust anyone else to take your place.) mistrust,no, i had confidence in my direct superiors, but you go through basic, airborne, and air assault training with virtually every member of your squad, you feel a certain responsibility towards them.Superiority complex, most likely, your taught that in the military, youre better than civilians, and i agree to an extent. as for abandoning my post i have 7 things to say to that:

L oyalty
D uty
R espect
S elfless service
H onor
I ntegrity
P ersonal courage

These are the 7 army core values, the values ingrained in every soldier, and the first letter of all the values create the acronym "ldrship" or LEADERSHIP. with that being said, i felt all of analyzed all of these aspects before making my decision not to leave. I felt such a strong attachment, such a strong commitment to my friends, that i would give my life to save theirs. Can you say you bear any such loyalties? even to yourself and even to superseding your own safety? i can prove i do, i bear the scar from a gunshot on my chest, i bear the wounds of losing friends that i love, and i bear the scars, of pride. Do you?

Thank you all whove posted here, i was looking for confirmation and ive attained it.

I didn't mention those misrepresentations of common kindness as a means of saying I do nothing. They're there to remind people that your good intentions can be lost in translation, and thus the best means of making good and making a difference is to do so with your own two hands. I do what I can for what I believe, and I'm glad to see that you acted in the same manner. There's no loss of love for a person who is willing to give themselves to their cause, but though my cause is more humbled it doesn't conclude my purpose as otiose or misused. I can't see the world through your eyes, and nor can you see mine, so it's improper for us to adequately judge one another's footsteps. I believe I mentioned that I do what I can for those around me. Be they friend or stranger it's no different then what you do, save that you traveled a farther distance to do so. In our effort to do good we can at times do damage and pain, but that should not disuade your attempts. All I've put forth here is what I know and what I've seen mixed with the awareness that I've likely been uninformed. And that's all you have on me, so there's no damage or pain here.
I've lost friends unfairly, and though they may not have been fighting it doesn't make their life any more worthless or warranted. And simply because I don't believe in killing doesn't make me an inferior person. My scars are from scrapes and burns I've had inflicted on the occasion of numerous accidents and blunders, but to assume I wouldn't do for others beyond what they'd do for me is nothing more than an empty statement with no backing. I see no heroism in scars, no greatness or decoration. They're a modest symbol of an event in your life. A tattoo of the happenstance that is life and how we've chosen to live it. Some mark our mistakes, some mark our mistfortunes and all have some form of negative connotation attached to them no matter what conceit we place in front of it. I let you know my thoughts because I interpreted some type of remorse, but evidently I was led out of bounds by your early posts. It seems a tad prejudiced to post something like this only looking for the gratification you already had, and I can quite easily see that pride you have as a result. From dreams of inflicted carnage to declaring pride in your actions leaves me with wonder at your statements, but if you've found your absolution then my best to you.

[leerock89]

I'm sorry I can't help but to laugh at this whole situation. All I see is one guy talking and another guy talking back. Both of them like talking a lot too. And I keep on reading some things that make this whole entire thread pointless. Mayhaps both of you should go back and read exactly what both of you wrote with a third persons perspective. ITS HILARIOUS!!

[alsharid]

For a person so dedicated to voicing their opinion, and so quick to criticize the position others have on things, you do little to nothing to change the world around you. The world in which you obviously hold such high contempt. You state openly that you do nothing unless you get instant gratification. No, i actually don't disagree with you on many aspects of your arguments. But to be able to sit back comfortably and say what you want when you've apparently and abrasively done nothing, is something that doesn't sit well with me. As for your statement that I'm seeking relief, again, i don't expect relief of this issue, nor do i actually feel guilty, which is the reason that I'm concerned. Its the opposite, im actually proud of their deaths, aside from the one of the children, the one with the stick, the other child, well fire a upon expect to be fired upon . im proud that im alive and theyre dead. im proud that i came back when so many of my friends didnt and havent. im proud of my accomplishments, which is actually what i consider my entire iraq tour, even the down times when i was playing halo. No, i dont feel guilt on the subject, yes, i see their faces in my dreams, i re-enact every scenario that i experienced, and i dont feel a shred of guilt. i wake up with the familiar adrenaline rush that i experienced then. the reason it affects my interactions with people, is that i want to spew it forth as ive done here, to scream at the top of my lungs in victory, like ancient gladiators. killing to me, is an honorable profession. i made money to kill. i dont feel bad about the deaths of any but that one child. one out of them all. many of the men i killed deserved to die by a much more harsh means. some, i would kill again for their crimes, rape, murder, and many others. To me, a murdered murderer is justice. I dont hate myself for theyre deaths, and i think in some aspects that its sad that i dont, and that, maybe, i should. So in posting this, i guess im mainly looking for confirmation.

But you my friend, who have most likely formed your opinions by observation and not actual experience, i pity. not bashing you at all. really. but to not have the experience that i have, i wouldnt be who i am today. i truly do care for the entirety of the world. and no, like i said before, i didnt support nor did i agree with the war in iraq, yes, i think that it has gone on too long, yes, there are a ton of iraqis that believe it was better with sadaam, and yes, im inclined to agree. but no, i dont think anything i did was exactly wrong, no, i dont feel any moral turpitude or remorse for it, and no, i dont believe that youre opinions are based upon any relative experience. i admire those who are fighting over there, on both sides. willing to die for what you believe is putting the fire to your mettle, testing if you believe what you say.

in regards to your comments (at best you've committed manslaughter on another HUMAN BEING. You seem to hold a grand mistrust in that you feel you're the only one who could protect. While it may be some type of superiority complex you felt at the time, or a simple parental like attachment the problem was strong enough to keep you from abandoning your post. You had no trust in your troop in their keeping self sufficient, nor did you trust anyone else to take your place.) mistrust,no, i had confidence in my direct superiors, but you go through basic, airborne, and air assault training with virtually every member of your squad, you feel a certain responsibility towards them.Superiority complex, most likely, your taught that in the military, youre better than civilians, and i agree to an extent. as for abandoning my post i have 7 things to say to that:

L oyalty
D uty
R espect
S elfless service
H onor
I ntegrity
P ersonal courage

These are the 7 army core values, the values ingrained in every soldier, and the first letter of all the values create the acronym "ldrship" or LEADERSHIP. with that being said, i felt all of analyzed all of these aspects before making my decision not to leave. I felt such a strong attachment, such a strong commitment to my friends, that i would give my life to save theirs. Can you say you bear any such loyalties? even to yourself and even to superseding your own safety? i can prove i do, i bear the scar from a gunshot on my chest, i bear the wounds of losing friends that i love, and i bear the scars, of pride. Do you?

Thank you all whove posted here, i was looking for confirmation and ive attained it.

wow........

[monsoon 10]

I'm sorry I can't help but to laugh at this whole situation. All I see is one guy talking and another guy talking back. Both of them like talking a lot too. And I keep on reading some things that make this whole entire thread pointless. Mayhaps both of you should go back and read exactly what both of you wrote with a third persons perspective. ITS HILARIOUS!!

I'm glad to find another person that thought the exact same thing about this argument.

[analogZero]

I'm sorry I can't help but to laugh at this whole situation. All I see is one guy talking and another guy talking back. Both of them like talking a lot too. And I keep on reading some things that make this whole entire thread pointless. Mayhaps both of you should go back and read exactly what both of you wrote with a third persons perspective. ITS HILARIOUS!!

dude, i had to read it all. how do you think I feel?

[animaniac]

I don't think this helps but....what do you think is worse a nightmare of your men who died cause you didn't shoot your gun or a nightmare of some people who you never knew but can put you and your man near death?

anyway that kid w/ a stick might have told you off to what you were about to raid if you didn't pull the trigger.

[Lady Earth]

Ok so I am going to end up being called Dr. Earth one day for this but....

Killling for any human, for the first time, and for variuos reasons is the hardest thing anyone will ever and I repeat EVER, have to do. Life is a precious and fleeing thing. Most give it for granted while others like to live it as if it was their last in Earth.

Wars ha a tendency of destroying many lives as well as hanging them. I understand why you feel the way you do, but one thing is for certain and you most keep it in mind. Over there it was either kill or be killed.

But now that you are home you feel like you did osmething wrong, which you did not. Your life is precious and you had to fight for it. The night mares will come but you have to keep that little light inisde shining through the darkness.

You need to let your body, mind, and soul, that you lived. That you kept fighting. Because if you don't...

Then there is realy nothing that will help you.

[soulinacup]

Killing someone pays a heavy price on the person who kills, whatever the situation, but I don't think that feeling guilty about it will help you, and it wont bring those who died back. I think you should try and accept that you have done this, to understand what you did was wrong and to try and move on. I don't think it will be easy, but I think you should try anyway because it might be a way for you start again and not have sleepless nights.

[Klard]

This may seem a little harsh, but here goes. I know little about actual combat, or war for that matter, but I know this.

People die. It happens. By joining the army you basically consented to taking the life of another in the name of your country. Whatever your reason for enlisting was at the time, how could you not know what might await you?

As for you feeling guilty about killing those people, it was you or them. Beating yourself up over people dying will not help you out in life. Analyzing the situation and pretending as though you could have stopped those things from happening is foolish. Feeling guilty over their deaths will not bring them back. You were in the service, you signed up for that. Once you start agonizing over people dying, you can't go back. Get off that path quickly.

Yes, killing is wrong. My religion tells me not to kill. I think that the commandment "Thou shalt not kill" was the best one. This is because killing someone kills you. It is the most difficult thing for a person to do. It causes severe damage to you mentally, not to mention what combat could do to you physically.

But as a wise man once said to me: "Opinions are like assholes, everyone has one." I suggest you get some help, either join a religion or find something meaningful to get your mind off this morbid topic.

[Oblivious]

The people that you killed.. it was for your country. Try to enjoy the path you've chosen man. Be happy! :D You defended yourself, and you have killed for the sake of good, not bad.